Lilux-help

lilux-help@lilux.lu

582 discussions

by Eric Dondelinger

Hi, the next LinuxDays preparation meeting is this friday afternoon at 14:30 at the CRP. I won't be able to be there, so in case someone can replace me... The subject of the meeting will be the courses' subjects, with a little agenda (description of the contents), and proposed speakers. There will also be propositions for the frame program (art, music, robotics, ...). So, we need to decide very quickly now what LiLux will propose for courses, and write up at least the agendas (a few lines describing the contents), and write up the names of people who can present these courses. Note for those who didn't see this before (I guess I wrote that only to the admin list until now): the next LinuxDays will be divided in two parts - 1) a business track at SI Expo, which will consist in a series of presentations by some companies and 2) two days of courses plus "villages" about different themes, consisting of stands with computers where people can come ask questions and try stuff out (i.e. no more expo and presentations like the previous years) - this will be end of january 2005. So for LiLux: The idea will be to have a "basic" course for beginners (really basic, don't go into installation or CLI confusion, just using an already installed system) - this we have partly prepared with the basic course from the LinuxDays 2003 and the LinuxFest 2004. Then, we should split up the "advanced" course from last year into several shorter courses regarding different services. This shouldn't be too hard I guess - any takers? If we have the energy and manpower, we could also propose new stuff - any proposals, people willing to do such stuff? I think it is important to be realistic in our propositions, or else we'll be really stretched in getting things done. We can do quite some stuff, especially if more people are willing to help out. Please join the effort! If we start now, we can get some nice courses done - if we start late, it will get painful. Preparing courses does take time to do properly. Greetings & thanks in advance, Eric

20 years, 11 months

Future coming sooner as I expected

by Patrick Kaell

I am checking the excellent news site www.theregister.co.uk almost every day. Today I saw this interesting news article: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/07/05/sender_authentication Now, what a coincidence! This article matches our recent discussion! The funny thing: It's probably coming sooner that even I expected in my wildest dreams ;-) Microsoft will also play an important role. Here is an extract of the article <extract> Sender ID is expected to be relatively simple to deploy, requiring little ongoing maintenance. In essence, all you need to do is publish the IP addresses of approved outgoing email MTAs in your domain name records. When your users send email, the recipient can make sure the mail is coming from authorized IP addresses by checking the DNS for the domain in the "From:" field. </extract> Greetings, Patrick Kaell

20 years, 11 months

Debian Sarge

by Patrick Useldinger

Hi All, I am looking for a complete CD/DVD set to install a Debian Sarge on a PC currently without Linux. Is a Sarge CD/DVD sufficient, or does this only permit to upgrade a Woody installation? Has anybody got these CDs/DVD so that I could copy them? Regards, -PU

20 years, 11 months

Linux Distros Compared

by Patrick Kaell

Here's a nice article comparing Fedora, Mandrake, Suse. Comparison matrices and screenshots are included: http://www.flexbeta.net/main/articles.php?action=show&id=70 There is also a new Slackware article: http://www.ofb.biz/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=315 Enjoy, Patrick Kaell

20 years, 11 months

Port 587 the solution?

by Patrick Kaell

Yes, I was a bit emotional in the last posts, and I wasn't always fair resp. did not accept some facts to prove my point. Now I see that I agree with Eric concerning important technical points, even if we have different philosophical views. Some may think that the subject may now be OT. Ok, these people can skip this mail if they want. I believe that we are all concerned by mail problems and that the last posts may also have put some facts in a new light, so it may be worth to keep some key elements of it. I agree that we should give up some freedom to get a bit more security. There are already infected PC's (modificated Netsky worms) who are sending "propaganda from the political right wing" to anybody using my E-Mail address as sender. I know this because I get sometimes "mail delivery errors". This is not nice, and I am ready to rethink and reconfigure my system to make life harder for these abuses. But I must get informed by the provider to prepare myself in advance. I did not mention it anymore in the last post, but blocking port 25 was not a problem for me at all (as I wrote the 28 May in this list). My girlfriend couldn't send any mail as long as I was not there (because I could't prepare myself in advance) but after I had identified the problem I simply used the alternative port 587 (RFC conformant) to send mail. I was glad that my mail provider Puretec supported this. So blocking port 25 was not the problem. But you need a mail provider who supports this alternative port. Eric, I know I was a bit unfair by saying that nobody uses the ISP provider's relay to send mail. There are many, I know. But there also people who send mail through their mail provider's SMTP server, which is perfectly legitimate. Blocking port 25 and relaying customer's mails through the ISP provider's server also makes sense at the moment. The ISP can filter the mails for worms (which might otherwise not be possible) and can not only log the connections but also the mail headers of all outbound mail (although some packet filters might also be able to do this (to look inside IP packets)). And you are right: There is currently no worm which would send through the ISP relay. I can't you show one, because I know of none. But as you said yourself: The internet today is not the internet of 10 years ago. You will see that the internet of tomorrow will not be the internet of today. In other words: The ISP mail relay solution you are using is only a temporal solution. As soon as this technique will be in widespread use (which will be the case if ISPs block port 25 and only allow access to their own mail relay), the worms (and the spammers who exploit remote controlled infected systems) *will* abuse it (we both agree that this will be trivial). The SMTP protocol dates back to 1983 and is not suitable anymore for today's internet. But I dislike temporal solutions that have been invented by several ISPs. I want a definitive solution that has been developed by the internet community. Actually this already exists: SMTP over SSL. It has already been implemented my all major mail clients (including Mozilla, Eudora and even Outlook). Now is the time for the ISPs to implement this community developed standard. And you do not need port 25 anymore, as SSL uses port 443! I wonder if PT actually guarantees you the "relay service", or if they were just to lazy to configure their SMTP server otherwise (as I know PT I suspect that the latter might be true). Also remember that any PT customer is able to send mails using your ETH address though the PT relay. Thus even by examining the mail header, I can not verify that this mail is really coming from you (if you do not signature your mail)! As long as your mail has not been relayed by ETH's mail servers the authenticity of your mail is questionable. Ok, I know that it is possible to fake the headers by spoofing ETH's IP addresses, but this is outside the possibilities of infected PCs and spammers. We need SMTP authentification over SSL, there is no way around this. The other solutions are temporal at best. Prepare that PT will block all non @pt.lu mails sometime in the future. Hope that they will warn you on time! Greeting, Patrick Kaell

20 years, 11 months

Interesting developement in software patents matter

by Eric Dondelinger

Hi, Heise has some good news for a change: (in german) http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/48796 Greetings, Eric

20 years, 11 months

SMTP

by Patrick Kaell

Here an explanation for those who have no clue about SMTP: Mail Client ------> My Mail Provider ------> Recipient's Mail Provider SMTP SMTP The "Mail Client" usually uses a dial up IP address. This is often an IP address which is on a Black List. Therefore the "Recipient's Mail Provider" would not accept it directly. The "Mail Client" therefore sends the mail to the "My Mail Provider". This host can authentificate the mail: the mail must be from the domain the "My Mail Provider" administrates and the E-Mail address must exist. A spammer cannot use "My Mail Provider" as an open relay because he has not a valid account on this server. The "My Mail Provider" sends the mail to "Recipient's Mail Provider". The "Recipient's Mail Provider" accepts the mail because the "My Mail Provider" has a fixed IP address and this IP address is not an a Black List. For those who still do not understand why it is not a good idea for Coditel to relay their customer's non xyz(a)coditel.lu addresses, here's the explanation: Unlike "My Mail Provider" Coditels relay could not ensure that I did not fake my From field. Infact I could even use a non existent address (as long the domain exists in the DNS). Coditel would essentially be an open relay reserved for their own customers. The From field could be anything a worm would find in a address database, Coditel's mail server could not filter it. Everybody understands? I mean if you understand the SMTP protocol and the fact I do not want to change my own E-Mail address everytime I change a dialup service, than you will see that I use my dialup access in a *sensible* way. And yes: The engineless car is waiting for you ;-)))))) Patrick Kaell

20 years, 11 months

"postscript header path" on suse 9.1?

by Kymon MacDaire

greetings, any idea how i can find the "postscript header path" on suse 9.1? i need to put a file there to run a particular latex package. more info can be found here: http://www.tug.org/tex-archive/macros/latex209/contrib/trees/tree-dvips/ best regards, kymon

20 years, 11 months

Re: [Lilux-help] Inventory

by Jang Lemmer

Fedora C1: MSI Mega 180 based PVR using MythTV (following Jarod's Guide)(will change to Debian testing soon) Debian testing: Asus L8400k personal Laptop Debian testing: Testing PC muLinux: Texting PC greetings Jang Lemmer At Thursday, 01 July 2004, Thierry Coutelier <Thierry.Coutelier@linux. lu> wrote: >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >Hash: SHA1 > >Patrick Useldinger wrote: >| I am not sure I should really do this, there's been too much arguing >| already. But, looking at this from a different point of view, I am >| curious to know who uses *which* distro for *what* purpose. >| >| So would you care, if you wish to participate, to send _one line per >| distro you use_ to this mailing list, in the form: >| >| distro 1: purpose 1 >| distro 2: purpose 2 >| [...] >| > >Fedora C1: desktop at work -> we wanted to stay on the RedHat line >Suse9.1: desktop on my PC and laptop -> useful for giving courses >Debian sarge: test PC >RedHat 7.2: Production servers at work (should go to Fedora C2 when I >finally get >time to repackage our software) >Fedora C1 (upgraded from RH9): Lilux server -> I's working. > >| Disto in the sense of Unix/Linux flavour. >| >| >| _______________________________________________ >| Lilux-help mailing list >| Lilux-help(a)lilux.lu >| http://lilux.lu/mailman/listinfo/lilux-help > >- -- >Thierry Coutelier Président LiLux asbl >7, Rue Jacques Sturm L-2556 Luxembourg >Office:+352 710725 608 Home:+352 406776 >http://www.linux.lu/ > >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- >Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (GNU/Linux) >Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org > >iD8DBQFA47wlPOfrcNNQX7oRAtnLAKCJoPsJVUCo1XHQunflK7clD4+gcwCdFSxz >IYvbQKKFJcYpAjO+vgDAsgA= >=gFS4 >-----END PGP SIGNATURE----- >_______________________________________________ >Lilux-help mailing list >Lilux-help(a)lilux.lu >http://lilux.lu/mailman/listinfo/lilux-help > ---------------------------------------------------------- There are only 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary and those who don't. ---------------------------------------------------------- =================================================================== EASY and FREE access to your email anywhere: http://www.web.lu/web2mail/ ===================================================================

20 years, 11 months

Re: [Lilux-help] Distro is not as important as we all think

by Georges Toth

> > excuse me? > > i _fully_ disagree with your opinion. > > Are you sure? A distro is only a fraction of all the things you have to > choose. You have to start sometime. You can always change the distro > later. Really. You are a good example for this (you have used all sorts > of distros). You can even dual boot different distros and share the swap > partition, the /home partition (uid and gid must be the same) and the > /usr/local partition (for the self compiled programs). a fraction? what is a distro? what makes up a distro? - the package management - init tools - system management tools did i forget anything? those 3 points (and mayba more) are different from distro to distro (if you leave clones out). those three points are very important to me when choosing a distro. i agree with you that if you don't care whats under the hood, etc, and just want to work, no matter how, and just let company X care about sec- probs etc.... it doesn't matter what distro you use and it matters more whether you choose xine or mplayer. but if you care, or have to care, that's a big difference. > > a distro is _VERY_ important. > > not every distro is the same, not every distro feels the same or has the > > same "features". > > As long as you are not *working*, this might make a big difference. As > soon as the system is set up, people sometimes want also to do some > *productive* things with their system. And then they may have chosen the > best distro but still do not known if they should take mplayer or xine > to watch movies for example. see above... > > i've been using over the years, all sorts of distros, and the one and > > only i really feel comfortable with right now, is gentoo. > > why? because it's source based, because it has IMO, the best package > > manager and system of them all, because _"I"_ have the freedom to do > > whatever i want, > > Sometimes, if you are a C programmer, you will not take the Gentoo > package, but download the source right away from the project's homepage > and modify things *yourself* for your needs. The Gentoo database will > not know that this software is installed on your system (unless you > package it yourself and take the pain to define the dependencies). The > next time you install a Gentoo package that needs the software, it will > install the package a second time without your patch. sorry, but do you have any clue about gentoo ? that might be right for rpm or deb or whatever, and the corresponding distros, but not for gentoo! gentoo is source-based anyway. if you wanna tweak stuff, it's a matter of secs or max. mins, and you everything done, AND the system knows about your software. with gentoo, we speak of ebuilds, not packages. ebuilds define how the pkmng-tool configures,compiles and installs your software. and to have deps right, that's easy.... you can as well have your ebuild included in portage, so others may profit of it as well. i don't see you problem with this... > That's the reason why I prefer distros without dependency checking. You > have seen a nice text editor optimized for LaTeX files? But you don't > need LaTeX, you want to use the editor anyway for other things? What if > the package maintainer of the LaTeX editor has decided for you that > there is a dependency, 'emerge editorxyz' will also install LaTeX, > unless you break dependencies explicitly. NO!!!!!!! ever heard of the "USE" variable ? as i said b4, your assumptions may be right for suse, rh, mandr, deb, whatever, but NOT!!!! for gentoo. > Anyway, Gentoo does even not use the original software from the > project's homepage, but specially patched versions. NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! gentoo does mirror the software on many many servers. if the source-package is not found there, it downloads it from the author's page. but it may as well only download it from the author's page. what is the problem with that? i still don't see any. and that gentoo patches _EVERY_ software is just plain wrong. they do apply patches to some software, to fix bugs, or whatever. but those patches are generally patches from the mailinglist of that project or so. > That is not how *I* define freedom! Freedom means to be independent from > the distro, and (all Gentoo users should listen now) from the network > connection! let me tell you this....before you judge about something and make assumptions about something you have obviously no clue about, TAKE THE TIME TO READ DOCS AND GET A CLUE ABOUT IT! > I want to be able to recover from a disc crash at *any* time by > reinstalling the distro from CD, reinstalling all patches and > applications from my archive and by restoring my data from my latest > backup. What if the Gentoo people have given up the distro yesterday? > You will not able to reinstall your system. You do not have paid for it, > there is no guarantee that the Gentoo service will last forever. yes you will be able. what if slackware will be discontinued? did you pay for it? who cares if you paid for something, when they give it up? your arguments are pretty bad. gentoo people have grp's or bins, and yes we do have recue and live cds as well. read above...i don't wanna re-write everything... > If Patrick Volkering gives up Slackware tomorrow, I will have plenty of > time to migrate, because I have saved a copy of everything I downloaded > and installed. I own my hardware and have everything under my control. so do i. and i bet i have more control over my distro than you have over yours > What about servers? If you have servers, it is important to keep them > all on the same patch level. If you install new patches, it is very wise > to test them on a test platform for a few weeks (new packages *can* > introduce problems). After the test, you have to install the tested > packages, even if there are newer ones on the distros servers. 'emerge > world' just doesn't cut it on servers! And our servers aren't even > connected to the internet! better inform yourself about what you write.... > But that is even the opposite of what you did. Didn't you find your > favorite distro by *using* Linux instead of thinking before using??? Why > do you recommend to the people a different learning curve than for > yourself? by think i include try. maybe not try for years, but try. sorry that i wasn't more explicit about that. > I never said otherwise. I only said that it may not be as important as > we all think. that's your opinion. not mine. -- regards, Georges Toth

20 years, 11 months

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